I’ve never heard of The Babys or either of their songs you posted. But I certainly was a huge fan of John Waite’s reverse psychology song ‘Missing You’. Right up there, in that category of song, with 10 C.C.’s ‘I’m not In Love’
Workin' on our Tune Tag, my bruh! Late to this par-tay! Earworm-heads, Tune in to Tune Tag, this Tuesday (10/29) to see our hero, Steve's 3rd Tune Tag tangle! It's a bangah!
First, as for 38 Special, I loved the fact that they were singing about my favorite '50s sitcom, "I Love Loosely"! "Hold On, Lucy!" Second, of the battle of the riffs 'tween Billy Joel and Babys, it's doubtful Billy had an inside scoop on the song, inasmuch as Billy's (unlike "Every Time I Think of You") was self-contained. He wrote "YMBR," while no Baby wrote "Everytime" (not to mention the fact you cited that the two artists were on opposite coasts).
"Every Time I Think of You" was written by Jack Conrad and the man who co-wrote one of my favorite Beach Boys songs...ever, "Sail On, Sailor," Ray Kennedy. Conrad & Kennedy also wrote the other Babys hit, "Isn't It Time." All 3 of those Kennedy-co-penned songs I used to sing, a LOT, during my multitude of karaoke nights a decade ago! I love how (with me not making that connection THEN) I ended up loving (and loving to sing) THREE songs that have one guy connected! Clearly, there's something about what Kennedy brings to a song I can connect to/with!
John Waite: While not focusing on The Babys or Waite, per se, I know I've written, at least once, that Waite is on my list of favorite rock singers of mostly undersung singers, a list which also includes Rob Grill (Grass Roots), Pat Upton (Spiral Starecase), Tony Burrows (he's worth looking up), and a couple others.
More Waite: As for his '84 solo project with "Missing You," fellow Texan, Gary Myrick (of Epic Records group Gary Myrick & The Figures, 1980) landed 4 songs on Waite's "No Brakes" album, and played guitar throughout, including on "Missing You." I interviewed Gary a couple years ago, and he talked about that album. His manager had told him that solo Waite album was supposed to be a group album with a name.
Now there's the long, punny, informative BK comment that we all know and love!
Yes, I saw your Gary Myrick post and was going to link to it in my piece, but it felt a bit off-topic and the post was already too long, so I left it out. Sorry! So glad you include it here! I do remember Baad Eenglissh and that "supergroup."
I can totally see you belting out those early Babys hits at karaoke! I personally love those albums more than the later ones but I really think all 4 (well, the fifth and last one is okay too) are solid and their greatest hits is one of the best out there.
What do you mean Billy's was self-contained? You mean that the song was done prior to the release of MR? The opening riff of YMBR is so different than the rest of the song, which is why I created this fake history. Plus I like ruffling feathers. Don't get me near any pigeons or flamingos!
Last paragraph.....I was just trying to differentiate how each song was written: Billy wrote his, and The Babys' hit was an outside composition brought to the band. I don't, for a second, think anyone pilfered something, but, for those doubting Thomases or Thomasinas out there (there's always one or two!), that extra layer of impossibility (on top of the east/west coast thing) should solidify everything's on the up'n'up, regardless of how fake the created history! Just a way for me to share the writers of "Every Time I Think of You."
“Isn’t It Time” and “Every Time I Think of You” were both written by Jack Conrad and Ray Kennedy. “Midnight Rendezvous” was written by Jonathan Cain and John Waite.
Yes, that's what I thought, so riff thievery is still a possibility then! I was only talking about "MR." I was talking about the MR riff and the Billy Joel riff being the same. It has nothing to do with Conrad/Kennedy. I was merely trying to determine if there was proof that Billy had written YMBR prior to the Babys. I couldn't find any. It's also possible that an early version of YMBR was released prior to The Babys release, so I'm open to thievery either direction! I think the only solution is to duke it out in the mud wrestling pit.
So great to listen to some Babys and John Waite hits again. I'm also a big fan of that 38 Special song.
Interesting about the similarities, and the question always comes up for me when does something become musical theft. I know in other arts -- fiction, film -- some sort of synchronicity when people come up with very similar ideas and projects is quite common and not considered theft. But the laws around music copyright seem much stricter. Musical artists have to be so much more careful.
Probably due to generational differences I had no idea about The Babys. Reading the other comments I feel like I've just landed from Mars 😂
I can totally see why your wife says it must be hard to live inside your brain. As I told you before I'd love a tour inside your brain with the guaranteed promise that I'd be able to come back (mine is not a walk in the park either, but it's a devil I know 🤣).
This might be a long shot as the riff is not exactly the same, but it reminded me of this (from the 4 second mark):
I've totally forgotten about The Babys! I remember really liking their biggest hits and have a vague memory of this one. Good stuff! I never knew there was a feud between them and Billy Joel!
haha - the feud is all of my making of course! They two guitar riffs are exactly the same though and their albums were released weeks apart. Conspiracy or Earworms and Song Loops journalistic revelation? You decide.
An entertaining read while I ate my toast and drank my tea this morning. Thank you for the lols and the information. Was most enjoyable ☺️ and fyi dead or alive did not dislodge love is like oxygen from my brain! That, with a rocky horror ps pair of lips have been embeded in my brain for a few days now 😅
Thanks for reading and subscribing! Sorry that none of my talked about Earworms could dislodge Love Is Like Oxygen for you. Though that is a fun earworm to have IMO. Probably would think differently if it were for more than 2 days.
Finally someone answers my questions!;) I thought you said switching guns regarding 38’Special switching sides. Both would work. Maybe I should create a Midnight playlist post!
On the gun question, I kinda think you should run what ya brung. .38 Special being able to switch to a .22 and then to a 50 cal seems unfair. Knife fight I could see though.
Midnight songs, yeah. Personally I’d like to see a “Rock Around The Clock” series - Bill and His Comets could get you past any you couldn’t find just in the first verse…
I never put all those musical elements together! And yes, I was expecting more about The Babies, thank you MTV. Maybe next time you can shed light on the “Missing You” backstory involving a certain Nina Blackwood…
I did hear about that Nina Blackwood connection while researching! I had no idea at the time. Crazily, Waite is touring currently touring. But not coming to No Cal or Texas from what I can tell.
I was hoping Brad Kyle had written a piece on The Babys, but he hadn't! I was shocked. I was going to link to it for the history part. He's much more thorough than me (and knowledgable).
I’ve never heard of The Babys or either of their songs you posted. But I certainly was a huge fan of John Waite’s reverse psychology song ‘Missing You’. Right up there, in that category of song, with 10 C.C.’s ‘I’m not In Love’
😂😂😂
““You may be right,” I imagine Joel’s guitarist Dave Brown saying after Billy showed him the new riff to open the album.”
Jen, I love when you validate my bad jokes! I feel seen! 😀
Workin' on our Tune Tag, my bruh! Late to this par-tay! Earworm-heads, Tune in to Tune Tag, this Tuesday (10/29) to see our hero, Steve's 3rd Tune Tag tangle! It's a bangah!
First, as for 38 Special, I loved the fact that they were singing about my favorite '50s sitcom, "I Love Loosely"! "Hold On, Lucy!" Second, of the battle of the riffs 'tween Billy Joel and Babys, it's doubtful Billy had an inside scoop on the song, inasmuch as Billy's (unlike "Every Time I Think of You") was self-contained. He wrote "YMBR," while no Baby wrote "Everytime" (not to mention the fact you cited that the two artists were on opposite coasts).
"Every Time I Think of You" was written by Jack Conrad and the man who co-wrote one of my favorite Beach Boys songs...ever, "Sail On, Sailor," Ray Kennedy. Conrad & Kennedy also wrote the other Babys hit, "Isn't It Time." All 3 of those Kennedy-co-penned songs I used to sing, a LOT, during my multitude of karaoke nights a decade ago! I love how (with me not making that connection THEN) I ended up loving (and loving to sing) THREE songs that have one guy connected! Clearly, there's something about what Kennedy brings to a song I can connect to/with!
John Waite: While not focusing on The Babys or Waite, per se, I know I've written, at least once, that Waite is on my list of favorite rock singers of mostly undersung singers, a list which also includes Rob Grill (Grass Roots), Pat Upton (Spiral Starecase), Tony Burrows (he's worth looking up), and a couple others.
More Waite: As for his '84 solo project with "Missing You," fellow Texan, Gary Myrick (of Epic Records group Gary Myrick & The Figures, 1980) landed 4 songs on Waite's "No Brakes" album, and played guitar throughout, including on "Missing You." I interviewed Gary a couple years ago, and he talked about that album. His manager had told him that solo Waite album was supposed to be a group album with a name.
That "group with a name" would have to....uh, Waite 4 years, and Waite became (with Journey's Jonathan Caine and Neal Schon) a member of Bad English. Here's that Myrick interview: https://bradkyle.substack.com/p/he-talks-in-stereo-part-1-singerguitarist?utm_source=publication-search
This was a great "Earworm," Steve! This is why we Wormheads tune into WORM Radio!
Now there's the long, punny, informative BK comment that we all know and love!
Yes, I saw your Gary Myrick post and was going to link to it in my piece, but it felt a bit off-topic and the post was already too long, so I left it out. Sorry! So glad you include it here! I do remember Baad Eenglissh and that "supergroup."
I can totally see you belting out those early Babys hits at karaoke! I personally love those albums more than the later ones but I really think all 4 (well, the fifth and last one is okay too) are solid and their greatest hits is one of the best out there.
What do you mean Billy's was self-contained? You mean that the song was done prior to the release of MR? The opening riff of YMBR is so different than the rest of the song, which is why I created this fake history. Plus I like ruffling feathers. Don't get me near any pigeons or flamingos!
Last paragraph.....I was just trying to differentiate how each song was written: Billy wrote his, and The Babys' hit was an outside composition brought to the band. I don't, for a second, think anyone pilfered something, but, for those doubting Thomases or Thomasinas out there (there's always one or two!), that extra layer of impossibility (on top of the east/west coast thing) should solidify everything's on the up'n'up, regardless of how fake the created history! Just a way for me to share the writers of "Every Time I Think of You."
So those writers brought Midnight Rendezvous to Babys as well? I guess I missed that connection amidst all the inside scoops you revealed!
“Isn’t It Time” and “Every Time I Think of You” were both written by Jack Conrad and Ray Kennedy. “Midnight Rendezvous” was written by Jonathan Cain and John Waite.
Here’s Kennedy, from 1980, doing “Isn’t It Time”:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrQ6C_1JXCU
Yes, that's what I thought, so riff thievery is still a possibility then! I was only talking about "MR." I was talking about the MR riff and the Billy Joel riff being the same. It has nothing to do with Conrad/Kennedy. I was merely trying to determine if there was proof that Billy had written YMBR prior to the Babys. I couldn't find any. It's also possible that an early version of YMBR was released prior to The Babys release, so I'm open to thievery either direction! I think the only solution is to duke it out in the mud wrestling pit.
I guess I got all the songs confused. That sounds like me. Sorry for the contusion…..uh, confusion.😊
WORM Radio - love it!
So great to listen to some Babys and John Waite hits again. I'm also a big fan of that 38 Special song.
Interesting about the similarities, and the question always comes up for me when does something become musical theft. I know in other arts -- fiction, film -- some sort of synchronicity when people come up with very similar ideas and projects is quite common and not considered theft. But the laws around music copyright seem much stricter. Musical artists have to be so much more careful.
Probably due to generational differences I had no idea about The Babys. Reading the other comments I feel like I've just landed from Mars 😂
I can totally see why your wife says it must be hard to live inside your brain. As I told you before I'd love a tour inside your brain with the guaranteed promise that I'd be able to come back (mine is not a walk in the park either, but it's a devil I know 🤣).
This might be a long shot as the riff is not exactly the same, but it reminded me of this (from the 4 second mark):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LalPz4lIZYk
I've totally forgotten about The Babys! I remember really liking their biggest hits and have a vague memory of this one. Good stuff! I never knew there was a feud between them and Billy Joel!
haha - the feud is all of my making of course! They two guitar riffs are exactly the same though and their albums were released weeks apart. Conspiracy or Earworms and Song Loops journalistic revelation? You decide.
I've no doubt you've hit on something the world has missed!
An entertaining read while I ate my toast and drank my tea this morning. Thank you for the lols and the information. Was most enjoyable ☺️ and fyi dead or alive did not dislodge love is like oxygen from my brain! That, with a rocky horror ps pair of lips have been embeded in my brain for a few days now 😅
Thanks for reading and subscribing! Sorry that none of my talked about Earworms could dislodge Love Is Like Oxygen for you. Though that is a fun earworm to have IMO. Probably would think differently if it were for more than 2 days.
Only about 3 or 4 days, was the salmon dance before that 🤣 hopefully it'll change soon 🤞
I do love The Babys! I'm actually seeing John Waite in concert at COC in Feb!
Nice! I didn’t know he was touring again. I’ll see if he’s coming to No Cal too.
Q1. I don’t remember “Midnight Rendezvous”, but “Midnight At The Oasis” is in my head now. And yours…
Q2. .38 Special wins, but only after switching sides several times
Q3. Not a question
Q4. Yes
Finally someone answers my questions!;) I thought you said switching guns regarding 38’Special switching sides. Both would work. Maybe I should create a Midnight playlist post!
On the gun question, I kinda think you should run what ya brung. .38 Special being able to switch to a .22 and then to a 50 cal seems unfair. Knife fight I could see though.
Midnight songs, yeah. Personally I’d like to see a “Rock Around The Clock” series - Bill and His Comets could get you past any you couldn’t find just in the first verse…
I never put all those musical elements together! And yes, I was expecting more about The Babies, thank you MTV. Maybe next time you can shed light on the “Missing You” backstory involving a certain Nina Blackwood…
I did hear about that Nina Blackwood connection while researching! I had no idea at the time. Crazily, Waite is touring currently touring. But not coming to No Cal or Texas from what I can tell.
I was hoping Brad Kyle had written a piece on The Babys, but he hadn't! I was shocked. I was going to link to it for the history part. He's much more thorough than me (and knowledgable).
I’m sure Brad has already read the article! 😄 I’ll have to see if Waite is coming to Mi.
Ha - Brad just commented and gave some of the background you might be looking for!:)
Some fuzzy math here but You May Be Right.
Now that’s some solid algebra!
Their second album Broken Heart is solid top to bottom. One of my favorite rock records.
Is that your way of saying it doesn't add up? That I'm dividing but not conquering? That I've counted my chickens before they hatched?
Geez, I haven't heard "Midnight Rendezvous" for years. And it does sound like "You May Be Right." ((Revelation!))
Thanks, Jim! And thanks for corroborating my hypothesis!